Posts by sqroot

    I've got the same issue (I've had it ever since I started playing the game).

    Choosing Europe won't get you past the "We are verifying your Agent credentials ..." screen, while choosing "Automatic" will assign you to the european servers if that's where you're from.

    EDIT: Actually, I can't even connect via automatic right now. Maybe the servers are just down? The website is way slower than usual as well.

    I don't think I've had an issue with sprint before, what do you mean?

    It's also been a long time since I've had hitbox issues.

    As for cooking grenades, I think I prefer it as it - unavoidable deaths from explosions suck.

    Not sure if the game has enough players to implement a system where you avoid specific people.

    The worst part about the metal reaper is that it doesn't really seem to count as a player, which means that spawns don't react to the metal reaper, making it possible for reapers to just run into the spawn and spawnrape people.

    If your team collectively decides to attack it you win, otherwise you'll get spawnkilled a bunch of times.

    The sad reality is that the OCE region just isn't big enough for most publishers to publish in. I don't even think that it's because the servers are expensive, I seriously doubt that, but I can imagine that they just don't want to set a precedent for a dead local server.

    Either way, I don't think I've ever played a game where OCE players didn't get screwed in some way or another, or at least ended up with a dead server.

    Well, at least the Ak12 lasts longer than any other assault rifle because of the extended mag.

    To add some more to this, the "I shot him a billion times and yet he didn't die"-scenario might already occur if you hit people after the enemy's damage packets have already reached the server, but the kill hasn't gone through to you yet. This is still "fair between high and low pings", because your enemy actually killed you before you killed them. Switching to the alternative would amplify the situation, where hits that were fired before the enemy damage packets have reached the server, but didn't reach the server before the enemy packets, won't count. This is not fair for high pingers anymore, since they might have shot first, but their ping was too high for the packet to reach the server first.

    Still, trades are extremely annoying, and occur even in low ping vs low ping, where the scenario above wouldn't really be noticable.

    Designing netcode that is both fair for high pingers and fun for everyone is kind of an impossible task. Imo, when in doubt, you should design in favor of people with good connections, however harsh that may sound.

    the issue, sniper v smg at close range is the ttk. This may be resolved to some extent by the netcode fixes, but right now with an smg you've got a very high chance of trading even when you get your shots off first.

    Edit: Have to say that I really don't get where people are coming from with the view that snipers need to be improved at close range, especially to the detriment of smgs. Someone is going to have to explain that to me.

    Yeah, trades suck.

    If 2N is the ping of a player A and 2M is the ping of a player B, then because of post-mortem backwards reconciliation there's essentially a time frame of N + M in which trades can occur, which is quite big.

    The alternative to this is that the first packet reaching the server will confirm the kill and all later damage packets by the killed player end up getting ignored. This either reduces the trade time frame to 1/F, where F is the tickrate of the server, for when packets arrive during the same tick, or that a random winner is picked, in which case there are no trades. However, this alternative would also mean that people with high ping experience the "I shot him a billion times and yet he didn't die"-scenario.

    Personally, as a low-pinger, I'd obviously prefer this over all these trades that affect everyone involved.

    Buff SMGs that the first 7 bullets fired are near accurate (say 70%, but it may vary), but after that, have them be CFX50 hipfire inaccurate such that continuous spray at anything but close range is a liability. To regain the original accuracy, release mouse1 for ,lets say, 0.7 seconds (this will also vary between SMGs).

    This might make SMGs overtake the sniper in CQB, but the snipers will now have an edge over the SMGs in long ranges, as it should be. If the sniper can still get the SMG player in CQB, it will be a difference in skill.

    The way you describe it, it sounds more like a nerf than a buff, tbh. I don't think hipfire not being accurate enough is the issue in SMG vs sniper 1v1 situations at close range anyways; SMGs usually win that encounter if you aren't prescoped from my experience (the increased movement speed helps with dodging and the higher fire rate with kickback). The issue, in comparison to the FAMAS, for instance, is that the FAMAS is more versatile than the SMGs: Partially because the range is slightly higher, partially because the recoil is way easier to handle than on most SMGs. I'm not sure if it makes sense to 'fix' this either, as I can well imagine that the increased movement speed allows for rush tactics that don't work well with assault rifles, so the SMG probably has its place in secure point or SnD. In TDM, the increased movement speed is usually not significant enough to make me play SMG, although it does make flanking and outplaying people a lot easier. Occasionally having to deal with medium range encounters is just part of the chaotic nature of TDM, I guess, and I can imagine that buffing the SMGs to make them more versatile in TDM would make them too strong in other modes.

    As for weakening prescoping, I really like Misfire's suggestion for more bullet penetration.

    What I mean is that for body damage being nerfed, players would need to aim on the head, and if you balance well the recoil of weapons, the time to kill a player today, and the time to can get a headshot kill should be the same, especially because you die really fast in a lot of scenarios. //// Point blank was headshot kill with all the weapons on the range the weapon stay 100% of the damage, except some pistols, and the ttk was high as f many times, because if you need to get a headshot and the players can jump, the ttk will just be higher, and while you enemy is trying to hit your head, you can hit his body, it's a skill 1v1 for who hits the head first. And you can also create your playstyle of shooting the body or the head.

    This is kind of a long discussion tho, it's not a truth that can be proven on both sides.

    You might be right that it could work if you nerf recoil a lot, kickback, buff hipfire, nerf movement speed, etc., basically changing the game to something that resembles Point Blank, but I honestly think that this would change the game too much, and you'd have to rename it because it wouldn't really be the same game anymore. Ironsight's identity is to be similar to Call of Duty in many ways, and I believe a good deal of players play Ironsight because it resembles Call of Duty, not Point Blank.

    I don't have much to make my arguments make more sense to you, I just think you are seeing the changes in a wrong way, TTK is not really changed if a HS is a kill. and it's not cs GO the only FPS that HSs are important, You can use siege, as an example, older fps games, like crossfire, point blank, warface

    >TTK is not really changed if a HS is a kill

    This is objectively wrong for all reasonable definitions of "time to kill" I can come up with.

    You're right, siege is another example for a game that is slower than Ironsight. However, the overall TTK is also lower, which means that there's less TTK variation for headshots as well. Additionally there's no jumping, so movement is way more limited, which also makes it easier to hit headshots.

    Point blank / Project Blackout wasn't a oneshot to the head either with most guns if I remember correctly (it's been longer than half a decade since I played that). The guns were also way more accurate in hipfire than Ironsight (+ lower kickback and recoil, I believe), and Ironsight being an ADS-heavy game is just part of its identity.

    Never played warface, but crossfire is what I was thinking of when I mentioned Korea CS clones.

    Either way, none of this demonstrates that headshots are somehow the mark of FPS games, as there's at least as many (or more) counter examples where headshots don't oneshot.


    "And 20HP is not a big deal considering that the game would be based on HSs, Mainly because you would be a easy target for snipers, and being thicker means you would also be a easier target for bullets on the body."

    I don't see how the latter implies the former.

    Why do you believe that sniper hipfire is anywhere near feasible?

    Also, HP differences create TTK variation, which is usually a bad idea (and I don't think more HP on the male characters is a fair and good solution to the problem).

    Not sniper hipfire, all weapons hip fire, because it makes sniper terrible at short range, so snipers would actually be able to do something

    Nerfing hipfire won't change anything about how well the sniper performs in close range combat because using ADS on the FAMAS is usually more effective than the hipfire on SMGs anyways.

    • Hipfire is easy, but ADS with ARs like the FAMAS is more effective on most maps, even at close range (except for maybe Dam or Cloud9, but I believe that those maps are inherently broken anyways).
    • I strongly disagree that you can't notice a difference between good and bad players in terms of aim, that doesn't reflect my experience at all.
    • Headshots are underpowered because Ironsight is a fast game with low TTK and buffing headshots would result in huge TTK variation. This can make sense if your TTK is high in the first place so instead of flicking at heads you track them, like in Dirty Bomb, or if the game is considerably slower and makes aiming at the head way easier, like in CS. In Ironsight however, the character models move relatively much and relatively quickly; consistently hitting headshots would be almost impossible and in the end random headshots would decide most fights, especially with the current kickback, which you would have to nerf as well. So for this not to happen either the TTK would have to be increased significantly, or the game would have to be a lot slower, and in either case you might as well rename the game to something different as it would be a whole different game.
    • "Meanwhile, a SMG player can spam bullets from a short range and will get you killed in a second." - Luckily Ironsight doesn't only play out in situations where you're so close to your enemy that SMG hipfire will hit every bullet.
    • I strongly disagree that headshots are somehow the mark of FPS games or that it feels bad when your opponent doesn't die from a headshot. The only kind of FPS I know that does this is CS and its Korea clones, so it's certainly not "the mark of FPS games".
    • Snipers can be sufficiently effective at close range, as discussed in the other thread about this. If you prescope angles, hit your shots and position yourself well, you'll be able to win 1v1 situations. Sure, it's significantly harder, good people won't run into your prescope, dodge your shots, surprise you or rush with multiple people, but it's nowhere near impossible, as you claim. It's usually less effective than using an AR at that range (unless you're in a position where you can always prescope a small angle), but that's completely fine.
    • Additionally nerfing body damage would just result in more TTK randomness as described above.
    • Some people claim that the female model has the same hitbox as the male model. I haven't gotten a chance to verify this, but if this is true, there isn't a huge difference at all, except for maybe a bit of visibility.
    • Giving male models a 20HP buff would just result in more TTK variation, resulting in the same issues as above. I also doubt that people would ever use a female model - how thin are you gonna make them to compensate for the 20HP?
    • Buffing the move speed and the reload time of the sniper would seriously make it overpowered, especially with you suggesting that body shots should deal way less damage on other guns. The sniper would connect way better than it does now, you'd be able to re-position yourself more easily and peeking/shooting would be way more effective as well, not to mention that it has a huge advantage at range because consistently hitting headshots at range with an AR would be pretty much impossible.

    I think that if hip fire was nerfed it would be more ok to play sniper at short range, and the characters should be thinner to make it harder for sniper at further ranges, maybe all characters should be female. And to compensate who uses the male characters, give them +20 hp to get some advantages against rifles and smg's.

    Why do you believe that sniper hipfire is anywhere near feasible?

    Also, HP differences create TTK variation, which is usually a bad idea (and I don't think more HP on the male characters is a fair and good solution to the problem).

    am i using sr at close range? xD

    You guys all suggested are all wrong because we cannot have just one nerf/buff (ie just increase ads time on sr). We need multiple changes to raise and lower the effectiveness on mechanics which is actually having a full penetration mechanic. For ARs at least they can shoot the sniper through covers while the sniper is chambering the bullet. Then for smg they can just sweep the sniper easily.

    But there is one fix that should happen, make each sniper scope and each sr have the same ads time... blazer with 4x scope...

    I think having more penetration is a great suggestion to reduce the issue of repeated peeking and shooting. I'd love to see this. In order to keep things balanced and prevent people from prefiring every wall to scout for people, it would probably also make sense to remove hitmarkers for hits through walls, I think.

    As for ADS time, I don't think quickscoping is the huge issue anyways. I'd honestly even be fine with a slight increase, but it won't fix the situations that people in this thread are angry about, because prescoping is way more effective than quickscoping. That being said, if the ADS time was increased, the devs also need to fix the FOV-jump that occurs with the higher power scopes (when you zoom in with the 10x your zoom-view kinda jumps forward at one point), which is otherwise very annoying (and, apart from sway, the primary reason why I use the viper scope).

    I think your suggested damage model is unintuitive and frustrating. Judging the sweet spot is hard, and makes for very random encounters. That's what it felt like in BF.

    >And I always put questions 1x1 because if it is to put other players involved, maybe you never even close to the sniper.

    Sorry, I don't understand what you mean here.

    >And a sniper who dies for Scar-H or AUG from afar are just bad or medium snipers, here I am dealing with good players, the sniper class in ironsight is not easy for beginners, but good players and accustomed to the game are unbeatable.

    I've not yet met a sniper that didn't struggle when tapping them with the AUG or the Scar.

    >Another thing, the sniper should sway when walking

    It already does that, if you're talking about the scope.

    >The secondary in the game for any class does not make so much sense

    I disagree - I regularly switch to my secondary when I run out of ammo on other classes.

    >but for a sniper it leaves the class even more OP

    It allows people to have a weaker alternative for close range encounters, yes. Other classes should have a complementary secondary as well, so you aren't completely helpless at long range as an SMG, for instance (it would be helpful if the crossbow travel speed was faster, the bullet drop was less significant and you could see where your bolt goes to properly learn the bullet drop). Being completely helpless at some range with some weapon always sucks, you should always have a complementary secondary that's worse than the range-equivalent primary, has less ammo, but still allows you to react at that range.

    To throw out another example from CoD4: The deagle fulfilled that role for every single class in the game, both for SMGs and snipers.

    >almost always the sniper has a shotgun as secondary, and that up to 1 or 2 mt kill with 1 shot. surpassing any SMG.

    I don't see this that often. The shotgun is frustratingly inconsistent. If your opponent misses or tags with a SPAS shot and you haven't killed them before the second shot, you honestly don't deserve that kill. I also strongly disagree with the sentiment that the shotguns are stronger than the SMGs, because they're super inconsistent, have way less effective range, are way less forgiving and don't connect at all.

    "Wasn't I playing against you and RawSauz yesterday? You're usually pretty easy to hit, while RawSauz is very hard to hit, which is why I lost most fights against him, even occasionally at range."

    Not yesterday as I wasn't on, but pretty sure I will have played against you with Sauz at some point. To be fair, Sauz is about 10 times the player I am, as are both you and Seekax.

    Just to clarify if it came off wrong: I think overall you're a very good player, and dodging less than RawSauz doesn't mean much, since he's probably better at dodging than me or most other people as well. Just wanted to make a point that there are people in this game that I find extremely hard to hit with a sniper at close range.


    >I'd say a little longer scope time is a better solution, thus forcing snipers to use their secondary in "surprise" situations.

    I feel like this is already the case. Against decent players, I always need to switch to my secondary at close range.


    >Really the macro is another subject, for me the anticheat should have the whole macro program, be razer, be that universal and especially the bloody ones, but it has much more behind, partnerships and many "comradeships"

    This is a hard issue, because it's not necessarily possible for anticheats to detect software that is running as a driver as a cheat. When you've got a signed driver, the whole issue of anticheat gets kind of nasty. Some mice don't even run the macros off a driver, but off a built-in microchip in the mouse, and in that case it's basically impossible to detect macros except for a very shaky runtime analysis that tries to judge whether an input is "too deterministic".

    EDIT: Also to add: I don't disagree with everything you guys posted. The things I don't quote are either things that I already talked about or things I agree with, so take that confirmation implicitly. Even some of the things I quote I might agree with in some ways, just not in their entirety (or I just want to add something to the statement you made).

    To start this off: I'd really encourage anyone to try playing the sniper at close range for a while before making hypothetical statements.

    A quick tl;dr: I don't see a solution to this that doesn't make the sniper completely useless. Nerfing the RPM is the only thing I can see that is possible at all, and it "only" makes it easier for teams to rush snipers, keeps the sniper from connecting and increases the risk associated with the weapon. Many of you seem to disagree with the idea of a high risk, high reward, low RPM, high damage weapon in its entirety. I don't think that limiting a gun class to long range encounters exclusively is sensible on the maps in Ironsight either, considering that the concept is even dubious at best even in Battlefield (cf. BF1 vs BFBC2).

    I'd put myself in that latter group, not that I actually complain much about anything. If you're designing short, medium and long range weapons then it's not great balance if the longest range weapon is also extremely viable at short range.

    You don't have to spend much time looking at the 'best of ironsight' event vids to see just how viable at close range the sniper rifles are.

    I don't think the "best of ironsight" clips are a particularly good example, after all seekax and me posted clips of octakills, seekax' clip even being about him countersniping a bunch of snipers at midrange.

    The sniper isn't super viable at short range if you don't take ages to start shooting at the sniper. Try hitting someone at close range who's strafing and wiggling while you're suffering from kickback and we'll see. Wasn't I playing against you and RawSauz yesterday? You're usually pretty easy to hit, while RawSauz is very hard to hit, which is why I lost most fights against him, even occasionally at range.

    The opposite works as well; when you're using soft point it's pretty easy to counter-snipe snipers on airport with an AUG or a Scar and win the encounter because of kickback.

    I'll agree that it's a bit easy to hold angles with the sniper against multiple people because of the high RPM, but I won't agree that the sniper is somehow supposed to be as strong as the assault rifle in general close range encounters because it oneshots people and you can quickscope if you're lucky enough and your opponent doesn't shoot you.

    Oneshot headshots are a bad idea because they result in way more randomness in encounters. The faster the game, the less sense it makes to have a huge headshot multiplier.

    The thing is, at close range you at least have a chance to kill the sniper. At longe range... pff, not a single chance (sometimes you don't even see them).

    So, in my case, I got nothing against "agressive snipers".

    With soft point and a Scar or an AUG you can stand a chance at range against snipers. Killing someone with smart peeking will obviously still be easier with the sniper, but that's just the nature of the gun class, there's nothing you can or should do to fix it except for maybe making it harder to connect. At least I don't see a way to fix it without making the class useless.

    But there's one thing I'd for sure love to be nerfed, and that is the bolt cancel, which is when you shot and swich weapons, that makes your sniper reset the bolt letting it be able to shot again for almost half the time of a normal bolt action. It'd be great if they remove this kind of bs, that makes bolt action snipers shoot almost instantly after a previous shot.

    The bolt cancel does not give you a huge advantage, at least with the DSR. Gnomedalf made a video about it a while back when straight pull was still stronger. In fact, it's so insignificant that I have stopped quickswitching where possible because it's easier to see when your weapon is ready with the bolt animation and sound.

    Yeah, imo the "bolt cancel" is a very dirty exploit, devs should fix this asap. As for the headshots, well, for me the real bs is having to put 3 bullets in someone's head to kill him... it doesn't even matter if you shoot the head or body. Those who have the skill (or luck, whatever) to hit the head shouldn't be rewarded?

    And about the hipfire, I wouldn't mind if it was a bit nerfed.

    That's the issue, though. Hitting headshots in Ironsight involves a lot of luck, especially with this much kickback, and making headshots a oneshot would add way more TTK variation, which isn't desirable. As for bolt cancelling: See above.

    That being said, I'd love it if quickswitching cancelled even more animations, for instance reloads! There's so many clunky animations in this game that you can't cancel, it's a shame. In CoD4, quickswitching at the end of the reload shortened the reload time. I don't know what it was about it, but it just felt right. There were even a bunch of tricks you could do to get different animations when quickswitching, resulting in pretty crisp alternative animations (I'd show you some clips but it's probably hard to judge for someone who didn't play the game). Sadly, the animations in Ironsight are pretty clunky as well.


    >well, for this we have to assume that I got to where the sniper is

    If the sniper is outranging you because of smart positioning then he should win the fight, there's nothing wrong with that. There's not that many locations in the current map pool where snipers can actually outrange you properly, and flanking those is usually easy.

    >Often "dancing" in front of the sniper with A and D does not work

    I was playing a match just yesterday where I was missing a bunch of shots against a few very good players because of good movement. Maybe my aim is just bad, but I'm pretty sure that it had a good impact on me missing them.

    >Most snipers take a place and stay there ad-eternum

    I've honestly never seen a single good sniper who does that or a sniper that was successful with it, it's usually plebs.

    >on the nerf in the RPM, I do not think it would help, the sniper would still overpowered killing from near or far with 1 shooting apernas, we hardly see snipers doing double or triple kill, who will say quadra kill, the sniper depends on the players appear in the field of view will kill 1 to 1, RPM certainly is not the problem.

    If you think that the sniper connecting too quickly isn't the issue then you fundamentally disagree with the concept of a high risk, high reward, low RPM, high damage weapon like the sniper and you might as well have it removed. I don't see any other solution to "fix" this, and I disagree that it is an issue in the first place. Feel free to prove me wrong by suggesting a sensible solution, though.

    >I do not think also that buff secondary weapons can help in some way, they kill as fast as a rifle on many occasions, 3 shots of a desert, or 1 HS

    Again, damage is not the only relevant factor when considering the balance of weapons. All the secondaries cap out pretty early, and tapping to not run into buffering issues feels terrible. Recoil is high, damage drop off is high, most people don't use them in any way other than hipfire spam - the secondaries are pretty terrible compared to other FPS games.

    >If the opponent starts hitting the shots you will die, that is not certain

    I didn't claim it is certain. In fact, I didn't claim the equivalent for any of my points. For this point in particular, I was assuming a position without cover, like on airport. As for single kills induced by smart peeking, I don't know how you're gonna fix that without effectively removing the sniper class entirely.

    >The Sniper must be kind of forced to switch to a secondary weapon when he is close, if the snipers still attempt the quickscope, the game is failing.

    I don't see anything wrong with a sniper walking around a corner while scoped in and killing someone who is close while crossing the corner. I don't think this is a failure of the game at all.

    >The difficulty has to vary according to distance, in that you are right, the problem is that currently this balance is still hanging to the side of the sniper It is impossible to kill a minimally good sniper in long range, but it is not impossible for the sniper to kill any other closely, depending on the location, yet the advantage is the sniper.

    As mentioned above, I don't think fighting snipers is as difficult as you make it out to be (keywords: AUG, Scar, Soft Point). Also, I think reducing the entire matter of balance in Ironsight to 1v1 situations is a bit harsh - the whole point of a sniper is to be good at picking off single people for a high risk.

    >I agree that Bolt cancel is the most ridiculous thing in the history of FPS, the old CS's came with it and other games copied, does not make the slightest sense and only serves to circumvent an action of the game, pure exploit!

    "It doesn't make the slightest sense" is a terrible argument. Why is it bad for gameplay? Please don't reply with something mentioning "realism", that's not answering the question.

    >Finally, from everything I read here so far, I think it would make sense if the sniper's damage drop worked the other way around

    New battlefield games have this and it's unintuitive and feels terrible to play with, even with maps as huge as battlefield has. There's very little "super long range" sections on maps in Ironsight, and imho you might as well remove the snipers instead, because you'd be limiting snipers to the two small corridors on every map where you'd actually be able to oneshot.

    EDIT: I think I might have missunderstood what you guys mean with bolt cancel. If you don't just mean quickswitching after a shot, then ignore the stuff about bolt cancelling.

    When a sniper comes to the corner, quickscoping is the better option.

    I don't know about this, I prescope and walk around corners while scoped in or at least scope in while walking around the corner so that I'm fully scoped in when I pass the corner. I also sometimes quickscope in these instances, but I avoid it when I'm playing against good people, because I know that they will use the time it takes to scope in well.

    For me, the problem of balancing snipers is to decrease their effectiveness at close range without making them completely ineffective at range.

    The only way I can think of to achieve that is to make them wildly inaccurate while unscoped and increase the length of the scoping action to prevent quick scoping.

    They are already terribly inaccurate while unscoped. It's basically utterly pointless to ever try to noscope. I only use it when I'm gonna switch to my secondary anyways because it doesn't cost anything.

    As for quickscoping, I don't think that's the issue, as described in my post above - you shouldn't lose a fight where you meet a sniper and the sniper isn't scoped in yet. Quickscoping is fancy to pubstomp people or to kill people that don't see you, but it's not really all that effective against good people in an SnD-ish environment.

    I disagree, at least in non-SnD modes. That being said, I can imagine snipers being too strong in SnD. However: All your model shows is that snipers take a single shot to kill, not that they're necessarily overpowered. Here's a bunch of additions to your model that hint towards it not being so simple:

    • If you're using soft point and hit a sniper first, you win the fight, at least as long as you keep hitting your consecutive shots and the RPM of your weapon isn't that low. Some good snipers can overcome the kickback of a single hit, but usually not consecutive hits.
    • If the sniper isn't scoped in when you face them, you will end up winning the fight, at least if you aren't garbage.
    • If the sniper misses you once, you win the fight. Most people in this game don't wiggle (consecutive A-D tapping while in ADS and fighting someone), but it helps a great deal against snipers because it's significantly harder to hit someone who's wiggling and knows his movement tech.
    • If the sniper tags you because they hit the hand in front of your body, you win the fight.
    • At least without cover, the sniper doesn't connect as well as the other weapons, so if multiple people rush the sniper it's easy to overpower them.

    Personally, I play both the DSR and assault rifles in non-SnD modes, and on maps that aren't titan or airport, when playing the DSR, I feel like I need to try significantly harder to play as good as if I would use an AR, since I actually need to preaim every angle, need to be way more careful with my movements and my aim has to be better overall to perform. Most of the non-SnD modes are pretty chaotic, so it's very easy to get caught offguard with the sniper, which wouldn't be as much of an issue with the AR.

    However, in SnD it's usually the norm to preaim every angle and not to get caught off guard, so I can see them being overpowered there, as most of the above don't apply as much in SnD. Because of the more limited angles aiming isn't as much of a deal either.

    So let's talk about possible solutions.

    • If you nerf the damage of the sniper to not oneshot anymore, you might as well remove it from the game. Ironsight is a fast game, hitting body shots can already be a bit tricky against good opponents, consistently hitting headshots would be impossible, especially with you suffering from kickback if you take too long. Honestly, if that was to happen, I'd quit Ironsight. The game already lacks variety in gameplay, and I don't find playing AR all the time particularly exciting, especially since it's easier to do well with.
    • Increasing the ADS time won't help with most of the bullet points above, and especially not in SnD. I think it would result in the sniper being much less fun to play, but I doubt that it would become weaker.

    Now to my proposed solution. I think the biggest issue is in fact what you mentioned: Snipers still connect too well, especially in SnD. To fix this, you could nerf the RPM of the gun. This way to balance snipers was taken in CoD4 Promod, and it worked. Nerfing the RPM means that you can still hit single shots well, but if you ever get rushed by multiple people, miss, tag, whatever, you guaranteedly lose. In SnD, additionally limiting the amount of players that are allowed to play sniper to 1 is also helpful to prevent certain ridiculous strats.

    However, if you nerf the RPM, it should be viable for the snipers to switch to their secondary, so you'd need to fix and buff those as well, either by adding buffering, decreasing recoil or increasing range.

    Disregarding balance, there's also a few things that could be fixed to make the sniper more fun and more consistent to play. These may affect the balance a tiny bit, but it shouldn't be super significant:

    • Fixing the initial scope sway (as described in Guide to Micro Mechanics).
    • Fixing the bug where you can't sprint immediately after shooting and unscoping and need to wait for the reload animation to finish. Not sure what causes this, yet.
    • When shooting somebody's hand in front of the torso, the bullet should penetrate the hand and also hit the torso, killing the enemy instead of just tagging because it hit the hand first (Demo: This would make sniper hits feel less random.

    EDIT: Also, one last thing: Many people fall for the fallacy that because they died in a single shot, the sniper is overpowered. Not saying you do, just that I see it often. I understand that getting killed by a sniper can be frustrating because it feels like you can't do anything, but that doesn't mean that the gun is overpowered. In fact, other guns kind of suffer from the same issue because of the heavy kickback - if you get shot first and your opponent is hitting his shots, you'll usually die, no matter the situation.

    I think I even do worse on average with the sniper than with the assault rifle in non-SnD modes.

    Not to mention the majority of snipers camp, waiting for someone to appear and get an easy kill... well, at least it feels good when we get them from behind ^^

    Assuming you actually mean "camping", and not just "holding an angle for a short time": This is true, but I've seen people complain about snipers playing aggressively as well. The people that camp aren't usually that good anyways.

    AFAIK those 500 chips will not buy you the gun, you need to get it from a lootbox, despite what it says in the store screen. It'll be very expensive, even in europe.

    Considering the drop rates from the supply boxes, we'll assume that you only buy superior supply boxes (since we don't really know the rates of the other ones because they're very expensive, except for that they're very bad) and that the drop rates are rougly as Nopp (Drop rates in common crates) measured, i.e. about 2% for an orange weapon.

    There's 35 orange skins in total. Assuming that the probabilities for these are binomially distributed (they might not be, who knows, maybe you can't get duplicates on orange weapons?), we get a chance of ~0.06% to get the weapon we want (assuming we want that exact one).

    Thus, for an expected value of 1, we need about 1750 experiments, or 21000 chips. Even with a more generous drop rate of 3% per gun we'd need 1150 experiments or 13800 chips, amounts that no sane person would invest in an (often pretty mediocre) skin.

    If we are fine with any rare skin, even those that look like utter garbage and those that have 0 prestige because you get them from your dailies, 22 out of the 35 orange skins will do. In that case we get a chance of ~1.25% per box with an orange drop rate of 2% and thus need about 80 boxes or 960 chips to get any rare weapon.

    As for the first three clips, I imagine that to be a bug. I could also imagine it to be a cheat, but I doubt it. I think I've had that before once, but it was months ago and I didn't record it. No idea what causes it.

    As for the next two, are you running Ironsight off an HDD? I'm using an SSD and don't get the issue - possibly because textures, models etc. load quicker. Obviously this is still a bug - the loading screen just shouldn't finish before everything is loaded, or at least everything significant is loaded.

    Last one looks like packet loss of the person in question + interp (Your client interpolates the movement from the last two packets received by that person. If you suddenly don't get a packet anymore, for instance because there's a bunch of packet loss, it might keep interpolating the movement - which can result in character models glitching through walls in a straight line like in your clip and continiously shooting or even jumping).

    I haven't seen it happen with a good connection. I can imagine it happening with bad connections, though, since this game uses TCP and seems to never drop any received packets, no matter how out of date they are.

    I mean since the packets has to be recieved by your computer and if it was resent you would see that delay. (desyncs are also players going through walls and shooting u before u see then)

    Players walking through walls is a symptom of the same issue (+ interpolation), I guess. Players shooting you before you see them is usually due to your own ping.

    I guess that the alt-tab issue is basically just a bunch of packet loss because the game decides not to send or receive packets while alt-tabbed, so it's all the same issue.

    EDIT: Actually, considering that the game basically never drops packets, players shooting you "before" you see them can also be an extreme case of lag compensation where a player saw you at a whole different point in time.

    I even have a clip that I believe to be due to that issue:

    Here's a clip of an alt-tab induced desync:

    Typically, when players desync and shoot you (and it's not due to lag comp), it should look like this:

    (notice that you can still see the player before he shoots you, despite the teleport)

    I think that might also be because of the desync you get when you alt tab.

    well desyncs still happen without changing windows

    I haven't seen it happen with a good connection. I can imagine it happening with bad connections, though, since this game uses TCP and seems to never drop any received packets, no matter how out of date they are.

    I think that might also be because of the desync you get when you alt tab.

    On those occasions i had not pressed alt+tab before

    if you notice, in the second video the player that is "flying" leaves the match, that is why I pressed TAB shortly afterwards

    The player in question that is flying might have alt-tabbed too. You could be right as well though.

    but as I said, it should be only one clip from you alone. Only from your gameplay.

    I certainly don't see you saying anything of that sort in this thread, which is why I was asking the question. Thanks for clearing this up, though.

    To explain: I play together with someone else and I've got a clip where I kill a bunch of people, I die, he avenges me with a multikill, and I hit another multikill right after his. We both recorded the match, so what I had in mind was showing my gameplay and my death from my perspective, then his multikill from his perspective and finally my multikill from my perspective. There's two obvious cuts, but no discontinuity, as all these things are happening right after each other.

    Since that isn't allowed, I guess I'll just upload my own part of the clip, although I think that without context it's a lot less interesting.

    Nice video ... especially for the comparison of the weapon recoil when you shoot at the wall and the virtually non-existing recoil when you're in match with the weapons. Impressive, even more as you don't shoot in short bursts but mostly full auto all the time.

    Are you implying that he's cheating because he's controlling the recoil?

    If you aren't: The comparison at the start is obviously to showcase how difficult it is to control the recoil, not how strong the recoil is in practice.

    EDIT: Looks like OhEmGee was faster than me ;)

    some people are accused of being hackers because other people dont know some basics of the game like you listed, thats why i asked to the topic to be fixed. But anyway, l dont care that much.

    I don't see why anyone would accuse someone else of cheating for any of these mechanics, except for maybe name scouting, and that one should be very obvious to anyone playing the game.

    In either case, the fault lies with those who blindly accuse others for cheating in public despite having zero game knowledge, not with the game or the players using these mechanics.

    this should be fixed to help New players

    As neither of these give you a huge advantage, new players aren't exactly at a huge disadvantage, and thus fixing them won't help much. It's certainly not high priority, and I think having a bit of depth in terms of what you can learn about the game isn't terrible either, despite some of these things being unintuitive.

    However, if anyone was to 'fix' them, I'd think the following about either of these:

    • Without strafing, jumping becomes ineffective, and what little complexity the movement has is lost. I know some people utterly hate when movement is fun, adds depth to 1v1 situations or adds complexity, and would much rather prefer clunky and super simple movement like in ARMA or Battlefield (for reasons like 'Jumping is not realistic'), but I'm not one of those people. I'd honestly even prefer it if more movement mechanics were added. I don't think I'd like it if the W jump speed was upped to W+A/D jump speed either, since diagonal jumping feels more natural to me, which might be because Quake-style strafing, as present in many games, also encourages diagonal jumping.
    • With buffering, all of the semi-autos would also need to be re-balanced and probably additionally have their recoil reduced, but I'd be fine with it.
    • I'd also like if you could shoot while vaulting, however, as far as I know, your character model (and hitbox?) is kind of out of place when vaulting, which makes it hard to hit people that vault, so you'd also need to fix that.
    • Name scouting is unintuitive, but I think hiding enemy names behind the airport flaps, the titan smoke or the cruise water would result in weird interactions where you can see the enemy player model, but the name doesn't pop up, especially considering that many of these objects don't nearly obstruct your vision as much as smoke grenades do. It'd probably feel pretty weird, so I'd keep the mechanic.
    • I'd love it if the initial scope sway was removed entirely. Please don't force the sway on me instead, it can make the snipers very frustrating to use.
    • Half scoping barely affects gameplay. It looks cool, but I'd also be fine if the scope scopes in as quickly as it usually does. Adding more time to gain full accuracy instead would make jump peeking with snipers even less effective than it already is, and I'd hate to see that.

    Micro mechanics are mechanics that don't give you a huge advantage, but can give you the edge in an appropriate situation over someone equally skilled who doesn't know them.

    This post explains some of those micro mechanics I found over my time playing Ironsight.

    There's also a video illustrating them at the end.


    Jumping forward is slower than sprinting.

    However, if you hold W (your forward directional key) and A or D (your sideways directional keys) while jumping, you won't lose as much speed, and your jump will be a lot faster and thus further.

    This is presumably because the game slows down the speed induced by W, but not the speed induced by A or D.

    Because your character accelerates when holding any directional key instead of immediately reaching max speed, simply tapping A or D before the jump isn't sufficient; You need to hold either button for a short time before jumping so your character accelerates to the maximum diagonal speed.

    Your character doesn't make any sound while jumping and locks its speed in place, meaning that it can be useful to incoorporate jumping into your playstyle when peeking, for instance.

    However, be aware that your guns are more inaccurate during the jump, even when in ADS (aim down sight).


    Ironsight lacks buffering.

    Buffering is a feature that buffers ("remembers") a click when firing a semi-auto gun a second time before the delay induced by the fire-rate of the weapon after the first shot has passed. It then executes that click when the delay has fully passed, firing another bullet.

    In games with buffering, you can spam your clicks, and when you're clicking faster than the RPM (rounds per minute) of the weapon, your semi-auto weapon will fire at the maximum RPM.

    In games without buffering, when clicking faster than the RPM of the weapon, some clicks will get lost because they're executed during the delay that dictates that the semi-auto weapon isn't allowed to fire yet.

    Because of these lost clicks, when only clicking slightly faster than the RPM, your weapon will fire more slowly than the RPM.

    To illustrate:


    The horizontal line indicates the time line (left-to-right), vertical lines indicate a click or a shot.

    The lines between the "Clicks" and the "Shots with buffering" indicate where each buffered click is executed as a shot.

    This is why, when spamming your semi-auto, you'll often notice that it fires very inconsistently, sometimes faster and sometimes slower.

    You can avoid this by clicking at a speed close to (but slightly below) the RPM of the gun you use.

    This way you can achieve nearly max RPM, as opposed to when spamming the gun (you could also reach max RPM by spamming the gun at speeds that aren't really humanly possible).

    Vault skipping

    Vaulting in Ironsight blocks you from shooting for a considerable amount of time, while jumping doesn't.

    There are some vaulting locations in the game that you can simply jump over.

    However, when standing in front of the vaulting location and pressing Space (your jump button), your character will start vaulting, because vaulting and jumping use the same button and vaulting has priority over jumping.

    You can avoid this by not looking at the vaulting location when pressing Space: If you jump over the vaulting location sideways, you won't vault and will be able to shoot while doing so.

    Another way to avoid this is by jumping before the notification that tells you that you can vault with Space pops up. This is only possible when you have enough space to jump, though.

    You usually need to strafe to do this, because with strafing you'll jump further before reaching max height, meaning that you can pass the distance before the vault notification pops up more easily.

    Name scouting

    When aiming at an enemy player, their name pops up above their head.

    The name also pops up when your vision of the enemy is obstructed by an object without collision, for instance the conveyor belt flaps on airport, the fountain water on cruise or the rocket smoke on titan.

    This means that you can hover your crosshair over areas where you expect enemies that you can't see to be and see whether the name pops up to find and then kill them through the object that obstructs your vision.

    This doesn't work for the smoke of smoke grenades, as that removes the name popup for everyone in the smoke, even if you can see the player model.

    Scope desway

    When scoping in with the DSR, you might notice that it sometimes keeps swaying for a short time, despite you holding Shift (your sprint button) to hold your breath.

    This can mess up your accuracy when quickscoping.

    It happens for two reasons:

    • You don't hold or shortly release the Shift button when scoping in.
    • You scope in, unscope and then quickly rescope - your scope will sway when rescoping.

    If you avoid both of these, i.e. you hold Shift and always wait a short time before rescoping after unscoping, you won't suffer from the initial scope sway.

    You don't need to worry about waiting a small amount of time when firing, unscoping and rescoping, because the time delay you have to wait is shorter than the time it takes to reload for the next shot.

    Half scoping

    After jumping, it takes longer for your scope to scope in than normally.

    However, the time it takes for your sniper to become fully accurate stays the same: This means that after jumping you can fire accurately before your scope is fully scoped in, as long as you know where the middle of your screen is.

    Video illustration

    I don't think what you mean exists. At least not with keyboard and mouse.

    When you're hipfiring, your crosshair is always centered in the middle of the screen. When you turn your character, it stays that way, the gun has no effect on that.

    When you're adsing, your ADS is always centered in the middle of the screen. When you turn your character, it stays that way, the gun has no effect on that.

    So I can't possibly understand what you mean; there's no "gun momentum" that affects gameplay, no "responsiveness to the movement of the mouse" that is dictated by the weapon, no acceleration/deacceleration, etc.

    I can only think of two things that you might mean:

    • The animation of the gun when turning around while not in ADS might look slower than in other guns, although I have never noticed this, am not sure if it exists, and it has certainly no effect on gameplay.
    • Using a sight with a different zoom level might mean that you need to drag your mouse further to travel the same projected distance, although this is dependent on the sight, and not the gun.